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Captain Ron
Senior Member
Joined: 29 September 2009 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 157 |
![]() Topic: Purchase Property - Funds outside BrazilPosted: 17 May 2013 at 07:30 |
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Situation:- Property in Brazil. Owner lives overseas. Purchase funds overseas. Purchaser has Brazilian permanent visa.
Question:- Would such a transaction be legal? Can and how would this transaction proceed? What taxes, fees and catches could be expected?
Any info greatly appreciated.
PS. I spent hours searching the Forum and trying the search function - I keep getting a red message telling me that one of my search criteria is under three characters?
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jacare
Senior Member
Joined: 02 August 2006 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 1086 |
![]() Posted: 17 May 2013 at 10:00 |
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I have read about this. Almost no problem. The seller would need someone with power of attorney to go with you to the cartorio, if he couldn't make it himself. One area can be a problem. The seller is responsible for the capital gains tax. If he doesn't pay then it falls to the buyer.
Best Luck!!! Edited by jacare - 17 May 2013 at 10:01 |
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Em rio de piranha jacaré nada de costas.
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rhyncus
Newbie
Joined: 17 May 2013 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 27 |
![]() Posted: 17 May 2013 at 21:14 |
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uh Captain? I have been dealing with property and realtors and prefeituras here in Brasil for 4 years. it's very common to sell a property that you don't own. I would make absolutely sure this person is the real owner (if that's ever really possible here) and then I would say forget it anyway. my estimation is that property here is in a mega-bubble and as soon as the world economy flatlines, it will come crashing down. watch the currency rates. whenever the US news is good, the exchange rate goes down... counter-intuitive but people here are so afraid that the financial system here is such a sham, that if the US sneezes, Brazil's currency falters. the converse is also true. inflation is becoming a bigger problem here too. just be extremely careful, that's all.
and don't buy any property with squatters living on it. they can basically take ownership of your land. or take years to get removed.
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Captain Ron
Senior Member
Joined: 29 September 2009 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 157 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 18:40 |
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Thanks Jacare and rhyncus, I've picked up a couple of important points here.
I have been playing around with property here for the last 5 years so have a basic idea of the pitfalls. There is no problem with the ownership or documentation of the property but there are tennants renting it. I intend to continue renting to the present lessees, under a new contract, but wonder would it best to take vacany possession.
I also have to consider that as I am not declaring the funds into Brazil I can have problems in the future trying to get the money out.
At the moment I believe well located real estate in Brazil to be a good investment - one just has to be prepared to gambling with 'THE BUBBLE'
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Squiddie
Senior Member
Joined: 27 June 2010 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1503 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 19:21 |
Could you or someone clarify this? You mean the RF will put a NEW tax lien on the property that's no longer the seller's and make the buyer responsible that the seller ran off with the money? That seems unjust if it is the plain truth. There must be something more to it, can you explain please? |
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GreatBallsoFire
Gringoes.com Guru
Joined: 27 October 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2402 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 20:56 |
Ron, Please read about "declare your BACEN." Brazil now requires residents to declare all assets held aboad. The banks now require wired in funds to be matched to the BACEN reported. I find this paymentof capital gain a real deal killer. I am looking at two properties. One is a herenca where they are doing an inventario. The agent says the judge needs to see a written offer of 190,000 reais, but the family would accept 150,000. Agent suggested I bring a lawyer to meet the family's lawyer. The idea scares me. Other situation seller bought a property four years ago for about 130,000 reais, spent about 120 fixing up the place, now is asking 260,000 but he never registered the purchase at the cartorio and never paid the elderly owner of record the remaining 100,000 reais. Another headache would be the cap gain here. The seller has ties to organized crime.... Getting money out of country? Time to open a Cambio in Salvador for four or five months.....
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Simia quam similis, turpissimus bestia nobis. Oi amigo, pode trazer a saideira?
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Squiddie
Senior Member
Joined: 27 June 2010 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1503 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 21:49 |
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The longer I contemplate these reportings the more I think I will in the future avoid residency in any country. I will not take US citizenship to which I am long eligible. I might take citizenship in some obscure tax haven country and then just live in 2-3 different places in the world.
- Spring in the USA (3 months) - Winter and Spring in Brazil 3 months - a Month in Europe, a Month in India, etc. - Summer in Brazil. What's a good EU country without any draconian reporting requirements? |
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jacare
Senior Member
Joined: 02 August 2006 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 1086 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 22:20 |
http://www.receita.fazenda.gov.br/PessoaFisica/IRPF/2013/perguntao/assuntos/ganho-de-capital.htm 594 - Qual é o tratamento tributário do ganho de capital auferido na alienação de bens ou direitos situados no Brasil por não residente? *********** Atenção: A fonte pagadora adquirente, pessoa física ou jurídica residente ou domiciliada no Brasil, deve reter e recolher o imposto sobre a renda incidente sobre o ganho de capital, sob o código 0473,auferido por pessoa física ou jurídica residente ou domiciliada no exterior que alienar bens localizados no Brasil, ou o procurador do alienante quando este não der conhecimento à fonte pagadora de que o proprietário do imóvel, é residente no exterior (Lei nº 10.833, de 29 de dezembro de 2003, arts. 26 e 93, inciso II). |
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Em rio de piranha jacaré nada de costas.
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GreatBallsoFire
Gringoes.com Guru
Joined: 27 October 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2402 |
![]() Posted: 18 May 2013 at 22:43 |
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Capital gains realized by individuals on a sale of real property, are subject to Brazilian tax at a rate of 15%. The taxable gain is computed by deducting the acquisition costs from the gross selling price.
Capital gains earned by nonresidents who reside in countries that do not tax the relevant income or whose income tax rate is less than 20% are taxed in Brazil at a special rate. As of January 2004, capital gains earned by these individuals are subject to a withholding tax rate of 25%. However, gains are tax-exempt if you have owned the real estate for 20 or more years, or if the real estate is the sole estate you own, and you have owned it for at least 5 years and the sale price is not over, approximately, BRL 582,750 (US$ 259,000). Capital gains derived by individual residents from the transfer of any property or rights are taxed at a flat rate of 15%, which is final. Capital gains derived from the sale of property or rights where the sales price does not exceed BRL20,000 (US$8,889) are not taxable. However gains derived from sales of real estate acquired by the seller before 1970 are tax-exempt for Brazilian residents. Real estate acquired by the seller between 1970 and 1988 benefits from a progressive capital gains tax reduction. What about the five year and under 582,000 reais rule? |
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Simia quam similis, turpissimus bestia nobis. Oi amigo, pode trazer a saideira?
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Captain Ron
Senior Member
Joined: 29 September 2009 Location: Brazil Online Status: Offline Posts: 157 |
![]() Posted: 19 May 2013 at 08:50 |
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Some good info here - thanks guys.
Capital gain responsibility - I am sure the seller either doesn't know this or may not have mentioned it.
One could get caught out - BIG TIME!
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